9 Feb 2002

How can all things be pure?

Submitted by theshovel
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This was part of a discussion in the Shovel Shack. You can find it under "To the pure all things are pure". Jim

Are you saying that all things are pure because we are pure? Adam

Herein is wisdom, my brother. Now, I am going somewhere with this in relation to your questions ... so don't get your panties in a bunch just yet, okay?

The "thing" couldnt be pure unless the thing was cleansed .. same with we couldnt be pure unless we were a new thing made pure Adam

Yes, yes!

And according to the Law, one may almost say, all things are cleansed with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no forgiveness. Therefore it was necessary for the copies of the things in the heavens to be cleansed with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands, a mere copy of the true one, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us; Hebrews 9:22-24

And He said to them, ""Are you so lacking in understanding also? Do you not understand that whatever goes into the man from outside cannot defile him, because it does not go into his heart, but into his stomach, and is eliminated?'' (Thus He declared all foods clean.) Mark 7:18-19

I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean. Romans 14:14

What God has cleansed, no longer consider unholy Acts 10:15

Clean out the old leaven so that you may be a new lump, just as you are in fact unleavened. For Christ our Passover also has been sacrificed. 1 Corinthians 5:7

Okeedokee, then, let me tie a few things together here, okay?

...2 separate issues to me Adam

This is the source of your confusion, bro. You are trying to hold onto the viewpoint of the unclean conscience in determining how all things could be pure to the pure. Regarding these "2 separate issues" one is dead and one is alive; one is of the old, the other of the new; one is a consideration based on an empty thing desperately trying to fill itself, the other is the reality of a vessel filled with the treasure of Christ.

When Paul told the Corinthians to "clean out the old leaven" he was not at all suggesting that the leaven - which is the whole sin-conscious mind - was part of who they really were. His demand was that they were UNLEAVENED. So what was he telling them? Isn't it obvious? Throw out those old sin-conscious perceptions by which you make such ridiculous assessments of reality!!

Don't you see what you're trying to reconcile with the "to the pure all things are pure"? You're trying to align that which comes out of the empty life with the life of Christ. It can't be done. In other words, the insane stuff we do under that schizophrenic mindset we often adopt should stand out as such a glaring contradiction of everything we truly are - and inwardly know that we are. It's presence in us turns out to be the very thing that causes us to know that it is not of us. This was Paul's whole point to what he wrote in Romans 7. Ironically, in this, the presence of sin in our lives becomes the very vehicle by which we see that what truly comes out of the real person we are is in fact pure. Are you following me here?

How and why would we view all impure things in our lives as God? Do we go to say that pornography is Gods Spirit? [sorry for the boldness] Is murder pure? is what i just did pure? Adam

Our problem with all this is that religion has trained us to walk in this life as those who are partially cleansed, partially forgiven, only "in Christ" in a purely technical sense as opposed to being a living reality. Because of this horrendous denial of Christ all "in the name of Christ" we think it is somehow legitimate - or even more honest - to demand that who we are is a mixture of the insanity and the purity. The only "pure" thing about this is that it is pure bullshit. And I'm not sorry for the boldness.

Therefore what benefit were you then deriving from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the outcome of those things is death. Romans 6:21

The fact is that because the reality of the life of God is inside us we already know this stuff, we already are aware of the futility that is no longer who we are. You see, we keep trying to approach the life of God within us in a scholarly, doctrinal or intellectual fashion - but it can't be done!! I'm not suggesting that it's pointless to discuss the life - which is something that should be quite obvious - but any worthwhile discussion will take the form of a witness and not an intellectual exercise. This is what the true "doctrine" of Christ is all about - a living testimony of his life that can only be understood as our spirits witness with his spirit.

And they do. Our confusion in this is only related to the perversion pushed upon us by the fleshly reinterpretations of the miraculous. We already know the fruitlessness of the empty life and the death inherent in it. We already sense the shame of that which is produced by that which is devoid of God's life. We know this because we have been delivered from that deathly existence into a living relationship with God. We need no laws or principles to define this emptiness for us - for such a mindset is counterproductive to the presence of God's Spirit within us having made all things new and pure.

This newness and purity is related to the only real life there is ... not the perversion we have come to recognize as real life. The real you knows. The real you "sees" all things for what they truly are. The real you looks past the perversion and recognizes that the most horrendous murder that has ever happened in all of human history has been turned into something else altogether, for the murder of the son of God is to us the most awesome and wonderful and pure act that has ever taken place - for by it God destroyed the works of the flesh by condemning them in Christ and brought us into the life of God through it.

Love, Jim

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Random Shovelquote: Christ, not the Bible is the life (view all shovelquotes)

I discovered that the Bible was not the life, but that it declared the life. I used to be in bondage to a book, but the book tells me that I am not in bondage to anything! I also discovered that Jesus is The Word of God.   source